Ann I am so glad you have a wonderful supporter. I understand what you are saying about your hands. My hands. feet and back are the worse. I did have a few days a month ago where I had some really good days and I though it was starting to work but it wasn't a consistent improvement and it is worse then when I started. I am not crazy about the biologic, I just want my old life back. I want to walk the dog and go out with my daughters. My husband is not as supportive as yours. He just doesn't get it. Ann said:
I have been on MTX For almost 3 months...it is all I am on...not even any anti inflamatories...I have to say I just started to notice an improvement. I wouldn't say I have no symptoms, but I actually was half way through my day last week when For the first time in a very long time my hands didn't hurt. I was so excited I texted my husband...he's probably thrilled he doesn't have to massage my hands... Which he does...he is an awesome support system. But anyways I think it can work...for how long I don't know. That being said When I have the opportunity to go off of it and try a biologic I will...not thrilled with some of the side effects. They are tolerable but not desirable.
Lucia
I am sorry to hear that your husband doesn’t get it. I am very fortunate my husband is very supportive. My kids are also. I have two boys 22 and 19 and my daughter is 14. They all are supportive. My PSa is mostly in my hands so the MTX doesn’t have to do much except for my hands and fatigue The fatigue is a little betterh. When I feel better the fatigue is better. I do have to admit even though my family is such a support there are people that just shrug off the arthritis thing. I think they think I just whine about my hands hurting. If only they knew how this disease makes you feel. I started therapeutic massages a few months ago. Mostly to relieve stress which I was hoping would ease my symptoms. It’s been wonderful. You may want to try that. Most massage therapists “get it”. Wish you well…
I took Metho for a few years, but always in conjunction with another med, never alone. I even injected it. Are they giving you any Prednisone or TNF blockers for the inflammation? I also take Lyrica for the Fibro., but Savella (antidepressant) was designed specifically for the Fibro and it works wonders in conjunction with the Lyrica. It is a new med in the market. They are giving you opiates for pain because they are not treating the root or cause of the problem. My pain is also unbearable when they take away my TNF blockers whenever I get sick. Tell your doc, and hang in there. Some days are really bad, but some are bearable. Talk to me whenever you cannot handle it. I hear you because I am there.
I am rowing in the same boat you are. My health insurance pays 100% of the Humira or Enbrel after I meet the copayment of $1500 for the year. I usually get the Pharmaceutical to meet my copay with the use of grants. They get lots of money from me the rest of the year to cover the grant anyway.
Jenny said:
I also started Methotrexate in April, progressed up to 8 pills/wk and felt very little relief. I had previously taken Humira, but had to stop due to the expense (had a high deductible on my insurance starting in January.)
When I spoke to my doctor about the methotrexate not really working, we determined that I really needed to go back on the Humira (I just had to bite the bullet with the expense and now I've met my deductible), and now I'm taking a combination... Humira shot once every two weeks and 4 methotrexate /week. I felt immediate relief upon taking the loading dose of Humira (2 shots on day one, 1 shot on day 8, then every two weeks.)
I have also tried Enbrel by itself and found that it worked very well, but my derm at the time at put me on cyclosporine to stabilize the psa before starting the injections.
My current derm says taking the meth with the Humira will increase it's effectiveness. I think he said it reduces the antibodies that are produced and interferes with the humira? not sure about that part.
Please read what I said carefully. I did not say it did not work for PSA. Do some research.
robd0gg said:
I am pretty new to all this myself, and while I appreciate hearing the experiences of others, please be careful when making (or accepting as fact) blanket statements like the one above. I.e. that MTX does not work for PsA. it's simply not true. I have only been on it a few weeks myself, but have noticed some slight improvement, in particular the swelling has gone down on two of my fingers. but my point is, don't take anecdotal experiences as fact and be cautious about when stating an opinion that use words such as all, never, none as the previous poster implied
I should mention that I have three daughters 24, 23 and 13 who are so helpful. I work full time in my home and if they are home they are trying to help. Especially my middle one. I think my husband is so used to being so capable that he can't get used to the fact that I can't do it all anymore. I think he gets that I have the disease but has no idea of the pain I am in. Thanks for the tip about massage therapy but I would be afraid of having anyone touch my back right now. I bet it would be great for my hands,feet and shoulders though. I know what you are feeling about your hands, that can be extremely painful. Glad the massages help!
Ann said:
Lucia I am sorry to hear that your husband doesn't get it. I am very fortunate my husband is very supportive. My kids are also. I have two boys 22 and 19 and my daughter is 14. They all are supportive. My PSa is mostly in my hands so the MTX doesn't have to do much except for my hands and fatigue The fatigue is a little betterh. When I feel better the fatigue is better. I do have to admit even though my family is such a support there are people that just shrug off the arthritis thing. I think they think I just whine about my hands hurting. If only they knew how this disease makes you feel. I started therapeutic massages a few months ago. Mostly to relieve stress which I was hoping would ease my symptoms. It's been wonderful. You may want to try that. Most massage therapists "get it". Wish you well...
Thanks for your help. I have spondylolithesis, ruptured discs, and have had three surgeries on my left knee with no option left except replacement. Throw in fibro and PsA and the pain is hard to manage. My family doc has mentioned Prednisone so I will be talking to the Rheum about that. What is a TNF blocker?
Gelita said:
I took Metho for a few years, but always in conjunction with another med, never alone. I even injected it. Are they giving you any Prednisone or TNF blockers for the inflammation? I also take Lyrica for the Fibro., but Savella (antidepressant) was designed specifically for the Fibro and it works wonders in conjunction with the Lyrica. It is a new med in the market. They are giving you opiates for pain because they are not treating the root or cause of the problem. My pain is also unbearable when they take away my TNF blockers whenever I get sick. Tell your doc, and hang in there. Some days are really bad, but some are bearable. Talk to me whenever you cannot handle it. I hear you because I am there.
I was on 2 methotrexate 10 mg tablets a week plus 2 folic acid and 2 Naproxyn per day. When I first started taking them 2 years or so ago, my psoriasis cleared up completely and my swollen finger joints settled. Just over the last month though one of my fingernails has psoriasis at the base under the nail and several of my finger joints have gone beserk. Specialist has now upped the dose of meth and folic acid to 3. I am amazed that you can take 6 or 8 meth pills - my doc says that 3 is the highest dosage that I can take.
I am rowing in the same boat you are. My health insurance pays 100% of the Humira or Enbrel after I meet the copayment of $1500 for the year. I usually get the Pharmaceutical to meet my copay with the use of grants. They get lots of money from me the rest of the year to cover the grant anyway.
Jenny said:
I also started Methotrexate in April, progressed up to 8 pills/wk and felt very little relief. I had previously taken Humira, but had to stop due to the expense (had a high deductible on my insurance starting in January.)
When I spoke to my doctor about the methotrexate not really working, we determined that I really needed to go back on the Humira (I just had to bite the bullet with the expense and now I've met my deductible), and now I'm taking a combination... Humira shot once every two weeks and 4 methotrexate /week. I felt immediate relief upon taking the loading dose of Humira (2 shots on day one, 1 shot on day 8, then every two weeks.)
I have also tried Enbrel by itself and found that it worked very well, but my derm at the time at put me on cyclosporine to stabilize the psa before starting the injections.
My current derm says taking the meth with the Humira will increase it's effectiveness. I think he said it reduces the antibodies that are produced and interferes with the humira? not sure about that part.
My mg is 2.5 so it evens out to what you are taking.
Rae said:
I was on 2 methotrexate 10 mg tablets a week plus 2 folic acid and 2 Naproxyn per day. When I first started taking them 2 years or so ago, my psoriasis cleared up completely and my swollen finger joints settled. Just over the last month though one of my fingernails has psoriasis at the base under the nail and several of my finger joints have gone beserk. Specialist has now upped the dose of meth and folic acid to 3. I am amazed that you can take 6 or 8 meth pills - my doc says that 3 is the highest dosage that I can take.
I'm under the impression that MtX's effective use is in conjunction with a biologic. When first diagnosed I was prescribed Humira + MtX and it was mighty effective. Then I stopped use and had a kid. After my daughter's birth I breastfed so no meds for 6 months. Then I went on Enbrel with no relief. So back to Humira + MtX. That provided relief but I spent 5 days out of the week with the flu from the MTX and decided that wasn't an improvement on my quality of life and quit the MTX. So the Humira rapidly began to fail and now I'm almost 2 months into Orencia infusions with no relief yet. My Rheumy told me that the MTX would prevent my body from developing an immunity to the biologic, resulting in another failed biologic. So now I have begun the Mtx injections which doesn't give me all the horrible side effects. I'm only 2 weeks on Mtx so I haven't had any relief. It's a wait see game that I never enjoy playing.
The bio and MTX dont work the same way. The bios work much closer to the source of the problem. MTX is much more indiscriminate- yes it will block some inflammation but it also interferes with other things like folic acid- that is why you have to take folic acid when on MTX. It is accurate to say there is alot of controversy wrt if MTX actually STOPs the progression of PsA. There haven’t been any studies that I can find that show that mtx does stop progression. It can be shown to have some affect and that is why they still use it. That and cost. There is no question in that the science most clearly shows that the bios are able to halt progression of damage for some people and slow it down for others. So in my view that is the difference between the two - if you want to stop the damage and you have moderate to severe disease than the bio is what is required.
A thought - if you have to go up to the full MTX dose before going on the bio - why don’t you just jump up to it now and get it over with? The side affects might be a bit more at first but it sounds like you are already suffering alot anyway. I jumped up after the initial trial,does for a week or so. I now take MTX Enbrel and volaren and sometimes tylenol. I can’t do narcotics and won’t.
"The researchers concluded that, despite some symptomatic and cutaneous benefits, their finding of a lack of effect for synovitis means methotrexate can't be considered to have "a true disease-modifying effect" in psoriatic arthritis."
For me, the MTX has cleared up my skin but it hasn't helped very much with the joint pain and swelling. I will be discussing this with my doc at my next appointment and I'm pretty sure she'll put me on a biologic.
They can answer most of our questions. Notice it is a Non-Profit Organization created for us patients and doctors to get information straight from the vine, as it funds vanguard research and researchers from around the World. You can check their new topics of research too, and where is the research taking place. Any one of us can become a member and support it, for it supports us. The information about the Foundation is at the bottom of the web page. It is important for us to get our facts from research that is not financially supported by pharmaceutical companies which can alter the outcomes. The Faculty of Medicine at the University of South Florida endorses them, and at times they do research for them. I hope this helps.
There is a really good presentation on all the meds in the members section of the spondilitis.org site too- they show really good data and comparisons- I am an engineer - so I liked to review all of the raw data to see if it substantiated what the docs where saying.